THE PEOPLING OF NEW YORK: MHC @ Lehman

I agree with you, May Poh, that “Crossing the Boundary was a great introduction. In so many ways it summarizes what we’ve spoken about in class, and it certainly brought up many interesting points. In reference to your first question, absolutely I’ve been to restaurants that either didn’t live up to and exceeded their reputations. Two name two, one of which I worked in, an Italian restaurant, La Famiglia, and a Thai restaurant called “Thai Golden.” These are both very small places, and are hardly ever packed. The problem may be that the location isn’t great, and maybe the people way upstate where I live aren’t open to foreign cuisines (especially the Thai), but the food at these restaurants is simply phenomenal!

Yes, the act of laying off workers is a selfish one. In a perfect world, and maybe in a perfect economy this wouldn’t have happened. But sadly, most people, especially people that are way-up-there are so blinded by money that they can’t see past it.

I’ve never had Swiss Fudge Cookies before, or even heard of them. For me, it isn’t personal, so I don’t know how the people that had these cookies in their lives for so many years feel. I hope that nothing that I love to eat will not be made again. It is interesting, though, how these cookies created this family and community, how all those people were connected because they played a role in making and buying cookies.

“The Work They Do” focused on the jobs that specific immigrant groups received upon coming to America throughout the decades. Though a lot of the chapter was boring description of the various unskilled labors people have been forced to do, the reading did bring a few interesting questions to mind.
We all knew that the so-called “dirty jobs” were usually given to the newest immigrants, but I thought it was peculiar how people from certain countries still found jobs that catered to their skills, however “unskilled” the jobs they acquired were considered. I realize that sounds a little absurd, but what I mean is this: though Italians weren’t able to come over and immediately rise up the social ladder, start businesses, and run companies, they had skills that no other immigrants had in shoemaking and masonry. Therefore, they transferred these abilities into jobs in New York. The Jewish came with skills of how to buy and sell, and became heavily involved in commerce. It is funny to note how even though these groups were at the bottom of the social chain, they still used the skills and abilities they brought with them to support themselves and their families the best they could.
What do you think makes a particular people acquire skills in a certain field? For example, why did the Eastern European Jews come with the knowledge of commerce whereas the Italians came with specific jobs as barbers and shoemakers? What skills did your ancestors bring with them to America, and what jobs did they bring about for them, if any?
The other question that came to mind while reading this pertained to the section about “Immigrants Now”. As we know, or have learned through this chapter, more modern immigrants who come to America have more opportunities to use their education and make money than in older times. In modern times, more and more educated people from middle or upper class families are coming to America- eager to use their knowledge to make something of themselves (or for themselves :)). Though many of them are able to move into steady, successful jobs in the mainstream economy, not all educated immigrants are so lucky. Many are faced with what the author refers to as “downward occupational mobility”, and must take jobs below what they are capable of.
What is this due to? Yes, probably some combination of a lack of American job experience and networking. Would you be willing to downgrade(for lack of a better word) your job in order to move to America? To accept a lower paying job that utilizes less of the knowledge that you worked hard for in your home land, in order to start a life in the U.S.? I guess what I’m asking is, why do you think people thought it was worth it to make this choice?

In response to Ilana’s question on how people acquire certain skill in fields is an interesting one which certainly has a lot more history that I can provide. Excuse me if this is not detailed enough or seems vague, but a teacher once broke down certain stereotypes to me. Many people have heard the stereotype how Jews are “hoarders of money”, or how they are very good at buying and selling things. There is a reason though that they have been seen this way, and it is because in Medieval times, many jews and arabs were the ones that were designated to handle money, as handling money was morally inappropriate for the christian religion. It’s really interesting that while they were chosen to be the bankers and loan sharks of the time, it is something that may have been handed down knowledge through the families, which might have given the jews the ability to be so good at buying and selling. (this is just a guess, but I think it makes sense!) Perhaps it is the same with other cultures as well, going back many years, there is a possibility that a certain race or religion was designated or excelled in a certain field and throughout the years families handed down that particular ability and knowledge, making it easier for certain immigrant groups to excel in certain jobs and tasks.
Ilana mentioned that there are certain immigrant groups who were educated and haven’t been as lucky as to find a good, profitable job. In one of my psych classes we were discussing how certain degrees are not nearly as reputable from other countries as ones from the US. Not only is there a learning curve, but there is a serious language barrier. This is not to be misinterpreted as racism though, as ones nationality does not affect their intelligence, but what is taught in different countries may not be the same things as what is taught and is necessary to know in the US. I am unsure if i would downgrade my job in order to move to America if it meant that I would have to deal with serious financial problems, a lack of respect from the people around me when I was used to have a lot of respect, and the need to start over completely. I think that it really would depend on what my living situation would be in my original home country- it’s hard to even imagine what many people need to go through in order to escape religious, political, or any other sort of terrors that would make me want to leave my country that badly. Because there are so many countries that are unstable and have victimized certain groups, or have closed many opportunity doors, I can see why many people would immigrate to the US. It just seems like it would not only be difficult to settle, but to change everything about yourself in order to adjust.

Noting on what Illana said, most of what we have read up until now depicts America as the “land of opportunity” where “streets are paved with gold.” Maybe the immigrant workers took this too literally, but they soon realzed what the deal was when they set foot on American soil. I believe that this is the classic story of the hard worker that worked his way up to the top. What I mean is that in America, even if you start off working with a job that may lean more toward the “downward occupational mobility” that doesnt mean that you are stuck there, because there are many opportunities ahead. If there weren’t, we would probably still have Five points and the crowded Lower East Side with tenaments. Immigrants learned how to move up in a foreign country- through hard work. I would be willing to downgrade myself to a lower paying job because I would be able to realize that I don’t have many options, at least not yet. There are probably many immigrants that would have been unmotivated by this situation, but I guess it takes mental toughness to roll with the punches. I think that the motivation that imigrants get when they come here to make a better life for themselves and their family drives them to move up in the SES (socio economic status) ladder of America. The reason being that people thought it was worth making this choice is becasue they knew that back where they came from conditions were far worse.

In response to Ilana’s question it is impossible to know what makes an individual acquire certain skills. It is however predictable to see a certain group pass down the same skills however. Mimi is correct in her brief discourse of medieval history. It was considered morally wrong for Christians to handle money and so Jews became the bankers and money handlers. This was also a time of great discrimination and antisemitism. There is no doubt in my mind that these roles and even biases were passed down throughout the centuries. My Italian ancestors came to this country with only agricultural skills. But some became mason workers, some became store owners, and yes humorously many of them became barbers. But in response to Ilana’s question of downward social mobility , I agree with Ivan that America still holds that idyllic image of golden streets. It has been established as the land of opportunity and so it remains. I have no doubt that many immigrants today believe that in taking a lower position in this country they can one day with a lot of effort achieve a greater position than they ever could in their home country. As Mimi noted intelligence cannot be attributed to nationality but education does truly vary throughout the world. In Italy for example high school is typically five years long but is concentrated primarily on an art from. So in this regard it easy to predict why certain immigrants hold certain positions and others often purse other positions.

The reading “Artist and Immigrants in NYC Restaurants” makes an articulate argument around the concept of restaurant as a “symbolism of social class”. In many ways, it is true that high-service restaurants earn their ratings from food critiques not solely on the quality of food, but the lavishness of interior design and service of the place as well. As first reading mentions, waiter is one of the most important staples to decide the restaurants standard. In high service restaurants, waiters are chosen selectively based on their language skill, outer appearance, level of education and etc because they represent the restaurant.

Just like when you have to go for a job interview, you’ll have to dress up to leave a nice impression. Waiters, in the world of service, are the outer jackets of the restaurant, as to signaling whether the restaurant will be an expensive Gucci or a bootleg faux- mumbo jumbo in the inside. All together, waiters become the “attraction of cultural capital” that represent the resource of wealth of the restaurant. From a consumer perspective, by attending a restaurant that has sommelier indicates his economic capability. And this definitely reminds me of the stupid idea of buying caviar that cost up to $$$$ but tastes fishy, salty and the requirement to be dressed up to enter a certain high-cost-consuming club. Personally I think it is made that why because snobby rich people consider them as a status symbol.

What do you think of the concept of attending an Ivy League university that costs $50-60,000 per year? Is this a symbolism of wealth as well? Do you feel that attending a public university will affect your salary or occupation in the future? List other examples that you believe portray social class distinction in America( ex. place, hobby …).

In a way going into America is a really complicated way of 4 square. While reading I came up with this theory. When you are living in your own country you could be the top of the top like the Ace or the head of the 4 square in your country but then you spot a 4 square court with gold paved on the court, now you think its gold and I want to go there but in reality its really gold chalk but you dont know it because you are too far away so you go over and notice that there is a line to get the court (Ellis Island or in this case JFK depending on your point of view of course). once you get on the court you start not as a queen or a king or an ace but a jack. A jack at the bottom, depending on how good you play the game or how other people are easily manipulated results in you moving up the social ladder and you need to know the rules of the game (in this case its money, language and connections). I dont want to sound so bad but this is how life in America works, we learn the rules and get more advantagous then the next person D=<. Maybe we come here for the disillusionment of freedom or the "happiness" we seek, maybe for political reasons. Its very hard to decide, maybe we came here for greed? I dont know. My grandma left because of political unrest, war and gang activity and thought America would be great to raise children. Which was half true. My old gym teacher from the Dominican Republic was a doctor and he left so he can become a gym teacher. Its hard to give a logical reason especially since I never immigrated….wow I dont know If i got sidetracked but thanks Ilana for helping me talk about this.

The second reading about the restaurants surprised me, I didnt know waiters and busboys made the same salary o.O. It blew my mind, No way im going to become a waiter now D=< kidding ^^ but anyways I do think that not only restaurants but anything that serves a specific type of neighborhood, would hire people that understand or reflect that kind of neighborhood. I tried applying to a boutique on 73rd and when I walked in the atmosphere rippled with a weird smell. And everyone looked so nice and dressy. I had a hole in my pants but they are my favorite pants still. I felt out of place in 5 seconds. My mom works in these as a janitor while everyone in the front are european and white. I dont think that attending a public university will affect you too much, I mean we all attend Lehman and everyone tells me at least Oh thats a wonderful college and I would love to go there and Hunter college was nominated as one of the best public educations out there. I mean what you really pay to go there is the name of the college. If you want to pay 50,000 per year for an education that you can get for about 5000 year at a public college then well…Ill let you decide xD

From both readings, I found “Artists and Immigrants in New York City Restaurants” a refreshing take on the immigration patterns into New York. The reading really resonates with what we discuss in class regarding the roles of food and immigration in NYC culture.
In response to Ilana’s question regarding downward occupational mobility, I think that it is important to mention that this has always been the case in immigration history, as Foner notes. Lifestyle conversion is a reality that has to be faced by every immigrant, no matter what their job in the home country was. This issue brings to light the importance of networking in the modern economy, and it is often the case that even an American who has graduated from college can’t do much for his or her career without some sort of social/occupational/educational network. Personally, I don’t think I would want to “downgrade” my job in order to move to America, unless the situation would really prove itself easier in this country as opposed to the home country. Mimi makes a good point regarding the issue, and points out that many are willing to downgrade to escape an unstable political/social/cultural environment in the home country. I think I would move and downgrade if I was being persecuted or suppressed, but I am sure there are people who decide to stay in their countries because they do not want to downgrade. This really reminds me of a part in “Persepolis” by Marjane Satrapi, when Marjane’s parents do not want to move out of Iran because they are afraid of the downgrade that Foner talks about.

In terms of what drives immigrants to work in certain fields, such as was described in “The Work They Do,” I believe the driving force in the job market can usually be traced back to necessity. Jews were notoriously limited in terms of what jobs they were legally permitted to perform, especially during the time of the Pale of Settlement (established in 1791), so they immersed themselves in the industries which were available to them (such as tailoring). Survival is about adaptability, so if Italians and Jews (as well as all other immigrant groups) wanted to be able to feed and provide for their families, it required them to acquire certain skills, and quickly. This even comes at the cost of downgrading, which “The Culture of the Cities” discusses.

As to whether I would be willing to sacrifice my job station in order to immigrate, it depends on the circumstances. If I were immigrating because of persecution, then of course I would be willing to downgrade; I would be grateful to be alive and to have a job at all. Although I would be earning less and would have a lower standard of living, at least I would be living. If I decided to emigrate due to other factors, however, such as to seek better financial opportunities, than because of political dissidence, then I would be disappointed to have to downgrade, since that would defeat the purpose of my emigration.

I think Ilana brought up a very interesting point about the skills that unique groups of immigrants bring into New York. I think by now, everyone knows that the Jewish immigrants were good at commerce and trade, and the Italian immigrants were better at shoemaking and haircutting. To answer Ilana’s question, I feel that particular people come in with specific skills because those skills are easily obtained in their home country. For example, a person coming from a country that relies heavily on agriculture, will come in with a handful of knowledge and skills in farming.
One fact that I couldn’t help but laugh about is the mention that Indian immigrants come in as doctors and engineers in this country. The reason I found it to be so humorous is because those two jobs are stereotypically very approved of by Indian parents and so most educated people of the South East Asian subcontinent end up going into those two fields. This is a case where people do not come into New York with certain skills because those skills are readily available in the immigrant country, but because being a doctor/engineer is a highly respected career choice there and acquiring such a high-end job in a country like America is seen as a dream come true (Being a doctor/engineer in western countries like America seems more reputable in people’s views than being one in another country like Bangladesh or India).
I think I mentioned in an earlier post that some people have a very difficult time getting used to being treated with less respect than they were in their home country as did my uncle. Never having to really experience this change in status, I wouldn’t know what I would honestly do. However, I do know for sure that if I were living the good life in my home country, with a well-paid job where I am respected and I have a big house with my family and friends, I wouldn’t want to move to America in the first place. If I was so anxious to see what New York was like, I would just come over for a visit, but I wouldn’t make the decision to move out of the country to live in America just so I can say “I live in New York” like a lot of others choose to do. I guess that could really say something about my personality—I choose to not take the risk of being in a new country to aspire for more, when I am doing absolutely fine where I am, despite how others view me.
As we discussed in class a few weeks ago, I think people originally made the choice to move here because conditions in their homeland were not so good and receiving pay in dollars would come to great use once they are sent back to the family who remProxy-Connection: keep-alive
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ned. However, I think now, people come in for mixed reasons—some might come in because they have this glorified view of New York being the world of opportunity and adventure and fun. Sure, it is all of those things, but people fail to realize that along with that, there is a lot of work and busyness (yeah, that’s a real word!) involved.

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I don’t know why the computer messed up the end of my post, so here it is again…

As we discussed in class a few weeks ago, I think people originally made the choice to move here because conditions in their homeland were not so good and receiving pay in dollars would come to great use once they are sent back to the family who remained. However, I think now, people come in for mixed reasons—some might come in because they have this glorified view of New York being the world of opportunity and adventure and fun. Sure, it is all of those things, but people fail to realize that along with that, there is a lot of work and busyness (yeah, that’s a real word!) involved.

To Ilana’s first question of what we think makes a particular people acquire skills in a certain field, I think it may be a case that immigrants come with certain unique skills because there is a lot of emphasis on that skill in their homeland. For example, in Italy, barbers and shoemakers may have an important role in the country’s history, so Italians think more highly of these jobs, and may strive to be a proud and accomplished barber or shoemaker. In America, we do not place any emphasis or prestige on barbers or shoemakers, so when Italians come over, they can use their skills as good barbers or shoemakers and do for Americans what no one else can, so they find jobs doing it.

Ilana also asked if we would be willing to downgrade our job in order to move to America? I don’t think it is possible for me to answer this question. I don’t think I can answer it unless I was in the shoes of foreigners, looking at America from the outside in. However, I can answer why I think people thought it was worth it to make the choice to downgrade their jobs. I think the answer pertains to an idea that has come up many times in this class, and thats the mental image of America that foreigners have. When looking at America the way they do, as a shining beacon of opportunity, downgrading your job to come here seems well worth it. Whether or not immigrants think it’s still worth it when they come over here and downgrade their jobs, I’m not so sure.

I would also like to say to Lubna that I looked up the word ‘busyness’ and it is actually a word. I was quite surprised. That is all.

People work in jobs that don’t use demand their talents because they don’t know the language and or their credentials don’t transfer. I think they accept job with lower wages and status because the dollar is worth more than their currency. I think the reason for choosing this option depends on how important status or wealth is to a person. Immigrants who are downgrading must have had worse financial situation because they are at the bottom of America’s economy and society due to their job. Immigrants in this situation earn so little that they probably cannot regain their status because they are unable to afford the services that would help them to do so.

If I was living by myself I would make moving to the U.S. a last resort because the current situation could improve. Also I wouldn’t want to start all over. If I were responsible for my family then I’d do it because others are dependent on the money coming from that job.

Attending an Ivy League gives anyone who hears your college’s name the idea that you are intelligent, driven, and active in numerous extra curricular activities. I admit this even though I think they are snobs and I would try to act as if that wasn’t an accomplishment. I think it isn’t that important know because people have adopted the thought that a person should go to a relatively inexpensive college for undergraduate and spend for graduate school due to the economy and the fact that getting a bachelor’s is more common, I don’t think it’s a symbolism of wealth as much as it used to be since people know that they give out scholarships based on need now. Attending certain public universities will affect my opportunities in the future because the older universities’ reputations can influence the employer’s decision. For example, at my school’s college fair Harvard’s representative majored in literature (I’m not sure but finance would not be an obvious career choice) and was employed at a financial firm. My mom pointed out where she went was one of the reasons that they were training her for a job in another field. Other examples that portray social class distinction are dining locations, neighborhoods, and clothing.

To Ilana’s question I would have to say that I do not know if I would be willing to downgrade my status and job just to move to the United States. I would say that if I was determined to leave my home country for the United States, for whatever reason, I would probably be willing to give that up because I would be losing so much more by moving. Just the action of moving to another country separates you from your home and from everyone you love and care for and I feel that if despite those facts I still wanted to leave then I definitely would not have a problem downgrading my job because those things, in my opinion are far more important. The readings were pretty dull even though I have realized that in all of these readings that there is the common question of why everyone decides to immigrate and stay in New York. Even now when some times people have to downgrade and live more difficult lives here than in their home countries people still immigrate here. And just thinking about how just moving is difficult but to have to suddenly struggle and deal with a worse job than you had before thus leading to worse living situations you have to ask yourself why exactly do people still move here. We obviously don’t know everything about other countries and the living situations there and it just makes me wonder.

Here is my entire post…I still don’t understand why the whole thing didn’t come up the first time…

I think Ilana brought up a very interesting point about the skills that unique groups of immigrants bring into New York. I think by now, everyone knows that the Jewish immigrants were good at commerce and trade, and the Italian immigrants were better at shoemaking and haircutting. To answer Ilana’s question, I feel that particular people come in with specific skills because those skills are easily obtained in their home country. For example, a person coming from a country that relies heavily on agriculture will come in with a handful of knowledge and skills in farming.

One fact that I couldn’t help but laugh about is the mention that Indian immigrants come in as doctors and engineers in this country. The reason I found it to be so humorous is because those two jobs are stereotypically very approved of by Indian parents and so most educated people of the South East Asian subcontinent end up going into those two fields. This is a case where people do not come into New York with certain skills because those skills are readily available in the immigrant country, but because being a doctor/engineer is a highly respected career choice there and acquiring such a high-end job in a country like America is seen as a dream come true (Being a doctor/engineer in western countries like America seems more reputable in people’s views than being one in another country like Bangladesh or India). 


I think I mentioned in an earlier post that some people have a very difficult time getting used to being treated with less respect than they were in their home country as did my uncle. Never having to really experience this change in status, I wouldn’t know what I would honestly do. However, I do know for sure that if I were living the good life in my home country, with a well-paid job where I am respected and I have a big house with my family and friends, I wouldn’t want to move to America in the first place. If I was so anxious to see what New York was like, I would just come over for a visit, but I wouldn’t make the decision to move out of the country to live in America just so I can say “I live in New York” like a lot of others choose to do. I guess that could really say something about my personality—I choose to not take the risk of being in a new country to aspire for more, when I am doing absolutely fine where I am, despite how others view me.

As we discussed in class a few weeks ago, I think people originally made the choice to move here because conditions in their homeland were not so good and receiving pay in dollars would come to great use once they are sent back to the family who remained. However, I think now, people come in for mixed reasons—some might come in because they have this glorified view of New York being the world of opportunity and adventure and fun. Sure, it is all of those things, but people fail to realize that along with that, there is a lot of work and busyness (yeah, that’s a real word!) involved.

What do you think makes a particular people acquire skills in a certain field?

My best guess is that immigrants acquire skills as a result of the culture and geography of their homeland. For example, if an immigrant came from a rural area, he would most likely be skilled in farming. If an immigrant came from a city, he would have industrial skills like shoe making. The climate and geography could determine the skills one would acquire. If someone lives near the water, he might learn how to fish. If someone lives in the countryside, he might learn how to raise sheep. Depending on the resources in a country, one might learn how to make cheese or harvest trees, etc. People learn skills based on what is around them and what is important to them.

What skills did your ancestors bring with them to America, and what jobs did they bring about for them, if any?

I have no idea what skills my ancestors brought with them to America. I don’t know much about my ancestors, but both of my parents are accountants. I always thought it was funny that they’re accountants because hate math and I’m bad at it.

What is downward occupational mobility to due?

Downward occupational mobility is due to a few factors. Many immigrants are not proficient in English. Either they cannot comprehend it, speak it, or write it. If someone does not know English, it would be very difficult for them to get a job in America. Also, their education and degree(s) may not be equivalent here. They may not meet the requirements for a job such as a doctor or a teacher. Also, I assume that immigrating to another country would be a hard adjustment. Depending on how much money someone came here with, it could be difficult for them to wait long enough to find a professional job.

Would you be willing to downgrade (for lack of a better word) your job in order to move to America?

It would depend on the circumstances. If I needed to flee persecution or war or something, I don’t think downgrading my job would be much of a concern of mine. But if I didn’t have any threat to me in my home country, I venture to say no that I would not be willing to downgrade. Why leave a good stable job for America? I don’t think I would be attracted enough to America to leave my home country if there were no problems for me at home.

What do you think makes a particular people acquire skills in a certain field?
Like Chris said, it is impossible to know why a certain group acquired certain skills. It is, however, possible to know how that group acquired that skill. Historically speaking Mimi’s example makes sense of how since the Jews always dealt with the money in the older times, they were better money handlers than the other groups.
When my parents moved to America, the only “skills” they had were their college degrees, motivation and the will to succeed. All those skills were enough for them to sustain and helped them launch to the point where they are now.
Ilana also asked: Would you be willing to downgrade our job in order to move to America? I personally would not, because I feel like India has westernized so much that if I had a decent job there I would like to stay there within my culture, family and heritage. I know a lot of people (within and outside my family) who will and have come to America just to come to this “land of glory” and downgrade their jobs.
To answer Maypoh’s question, I would say that the whole Ivy League education is a bit overrated to me. No doubt their education is very excellent, to me it’s like wearing Old Navy over Ralph Lauren; it’s a brand thing. Children of businessman and other high class families can not only afford, but want the best, and therefore Ivy leagues promise the best.

“What They Do”, I agree was a dry read. I think, Ilana, to answer your question that people acquired certain skills because of the region they lived it. Kind of like what Mimi was saying about hows the Jews and Arabs were known as traders, I think it depends on location. Israel is in the middle of Europe and Asia and therefore a huge trading stop. Italy, although rich in it’s own culture, was not exposed to the same amount of commerce and acquired skills based on what people in each town/city needed. My dad came to America with a the skills he needed to compete as a Pharmacist, and I think that is an example of how much times have changed. More people come to America as professionals, although, as the reading mentioned, the people who came to America in the first wave of immigration were not all unskilled and poor.

I think the whole “downgrading occupational mobility” was because there are some skills that just aren’t used or valued in the United States. For example, in the movie we were watching, the man who worked in the peddlers factory sewing, downgraded when coming to America. This was merely because America does not value religious scholars nearly as much as the “old country” did. In contrast the peddler, turned into a factory owner.

I think that in some cases I would take downgrade my occupation for life in America. Living in the U.S, we seem to take the things we have here for granted, but once you go into a third world country and come back, you really do feel like the streets are paved with gold. I know that the downgrading is easier said than done, and it’s not without frustration, but if I truly felt unsafe, religiously, economically, socially, and physically, I would make the move. The one thing that would keep me going would be that I could always acquire new skills in America and use those to my advantage here.

Ilana brings up an interesting point about immigrants taking low-level jobs. I think this shows the devotion so many immigrants have to their families, that they would be willing to take low-level jobs, but by working hard at them are able to support themselves and their families. Things don’t come quickly to anyone (least of all to immigrants), so they needed a great amount of patience and devotion to make new and better lives for themselves.

The skills that certain immigrant groups bring in are in large part due to the cultures the immigrants hail from. Italians are good at doing things with their hands (even going back to the Romans, whose architectural legacy includes roads and aqueducts), from painting to woodwork to barbers to shoemakers to playing piano, and maybe it’s because of the great Italian artistic strain. My Italian grandparents held many jobs, but pretty much all of them had something to do with the hands, whether it was as a line-cook, a butcher, or watchmaker. My Ukrainian grandparents also relied upon the use of their hands, especially in the case of my grandfather, who was a carpenter.

As far as downgrading one’s job in order to move to and live in America, I think this was much more the case in the past century than now. As Rav pointed out, some countries, especially India, are becoming so Westernized that people might actually want to move out of America. In fact we see this going on right now in America, a kind of “brain drain” where people get their education here, but move out of the country to places such as India, where there is in many instances greater opportunity for certain careers than in America. So whereas in the First and Second Waves of Immigration people flocked to America because of the immense opportunity it offered, today there is opportunity in other countries, sometimes and in some cases even greater than the opportunity here.

And Anna, Swiss Fudge Cookies are delicious. You have to try them! 🙂